tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post3389752021278884857..comments2024-03-22T01:06:23.845-07:00Comments on Confessions of a College Professor: The Community College Scam, Part 2Doomhttp://www.blogger.com/profile/04528555392898760692noreply@blogger.comBlogger8125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post-92085497189872802322014-05-08T12:52:27.868-07:002014-05-08T12:52:27.868-07:00That's a hard question to answer, since qualit...That's a hard question to answer, since quality very much depends on the school, and the instructor.<br /><br />For the school, find out "for real" how well the courses transfer to the local university--ask the university, since the cc will lie to you to make a sale. This is especially true if you're planning on getting a degree; a cheaper CC course is only a good deal if the credits transfer, otherwise it's a waste of money.<br /><br />For the instructor, check experience (it takes about 5 years to become a good teacher) and credentials (avoid "Math Education Master's" holders at all costs). <br /><br />Statistics is an odd subject. A 2000 level course I taught at Tulane was more advanced than a 6000 level course (grad school) taught at another nearby university. Another university had a 2000 level statistics course that was nearly identical to the statistics taught in a local high school (I saw with my own eyes).<br /><br />Bottom line, if money is an issue, check transferability first. If it doesn't transfer as the course you need it to be (not "as an elective", but "as the course you need for a degree"), you're wasting time and money.Doomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04528555392898760692noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post-47472215777226922342014-05-07T22:42:57.382-07:002014-05-07T22:42:57.382-07:00Any advice on how to determine the quality of the ...Any advice on how to determine the quality of the CC instruction one is receiving? <br /><br />In my case, I have a social science bachelor's, developed an interest in statistics late in college/through post-grad employment, and am hoping to re-align/build my technical skill set. This will, then, require I take additional math courses, and the local CCs are considerably cheaper and easier navigate while working full time. <br /><br />So, any advice on how to see whether the quality of instruction/depth of material covered would actually be worth the time and cost?Anonymoushttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08012054843421396319noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post-44974503400452649252014-04-28T12:53:02.707-07:002014-04-28T12:53:02.707-07:00Congratulations on navigating the minefield of hig...Congratulations on navigating the minefield of higher education. For it's worth, your area of the country is noteworthy for it's quality education--your remedial students are the average students most elsewhere in the country (I'm not joking, when one studies remedial education, we have to eliminate certain states because remedial hasn't been redefined there).Doomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04528555392898760692noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post-60505125129983304882014-04-28T12:24:25.938-07:002014-04-28T12:24:25.938-07:00I am a community college student in Casper, Wyomin...I am a community college student in Casper, Wyoming. Wyoming has only one university, in Laramie. I started at this community college because it meant I could save money while living at home. I don't pretend this school doesn't have its share of remedial classes and nondemanding "college" classes, but I try to steer toward more challenging classes and put in time on my own to learn the material to the depth I think I will need to succeed at the university. I am about to graduate with my two year degree and am already enrolled at the University of Wyoming for a bachelor's in geology with a minor in mathematics. <br />Moral--just because a student is forced to be at a community college by finances does not mean they are an automatic failure. A student who is bound and determined to learn will learn in spite of low standards and low expectations. I have done it with a combination of self-teaching and seeking out the more challenging classes/faculty. And I have no student loan debt at this point. Sphaleritehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16595970764756567187noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post-51675408374934332132014-02-23T19:57:16.766-08:002014-02-23T19:57:16.766-08:00The institution I used to teach at was a 2-year te...The institution I used to teach at was a 2-year technical college, though it ran programs in areas such as business and trade apprenticeships. Much of what I taught wasn't much more advanced than what I took in high school.<br /><br />But, before I quit more than a decade ago, a new wrinkle was added. It started offering 3-year "applied" degrees. One reason was because the president at the time was busy competing with the university on the other side of the city. But, if one looked closely, much of what went into those "degrees" wasn't a whole lot different than material that was already taught at the institution.<br /><br />It didn't take me long to conclude that those "degrees" were little more than a fancy cash grab using, as a way of luring people into signing up for those programs, the image of increased marketability of those who received them.<br />Quarter Wave Verticalhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03173446011323023116noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post-60131269580259846312013-11-16T13:32:46.053-08:002013-11-16T13:32:46.053-08:00Of course you are spot-on here about the community...Of course you are spot-on here about the community college "scam," but what's even sadder and more shocking is that 4-year, even accredited universities, are little better. It's sad but there is little such thing as a legitimately "higher education" anymore. It's all about moneyNobody's Foolhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04842975791706825253noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post-23437613961058379482013-11-11T16:45:07.261-08:002013-11-11T16:45:07.261-08:00Well, I'm going to address fixes soon (long ov...Well, I'm going to address fixes soon (long overdue, I know), but what would I have a CC do?<br /><br />Act with integrity. That is, after all, what accredited institutions are supposed to do. Failing that, shut down, at least the publicly funded ones.<br /><br />See, a public institution is supposed to HELP the public...instead, these things entrap citizens of the community into perpetual debt, in exchange for, well, less than a handful of beans.<br /><br />Now, I'm not talking all CCs, as there are legitimate ones around. That said, most of the ones opened in the last 20 years are just scamming the local community.<br /><br />Political pressure? Irrelevant in the face of integrity, or at least it should be. You acknowledge CCs are top-heavy with worthless admin, so I trust you agree is a CC cut back admin to sane levels (instead of the 1+ admin for each faculty we have today), that would go a long way to making CC's fiscally viable AND honest.<br /><br />I certainty can't address the entire economy in a reply, as you are correct there are some serious economic issues right now. But putting a bunch of people in perpetual debt in exchange for worthless slips of paper isn't remotely helping, and is almost certainly making things worse...and that's not what community institutions are supposed to do.Doomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/04528555392898760692noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-491174673971804494.post-5645308485660774542013-11-11T06:20:28.436-08:002013-11-11T06:20:28.436-08:00What would you have a CC do? It's a system-wid...What would you have a CC do? It's a system-wide failure -- or alternatively, mass education is doomed to fail since most of the population is ineducable. There is political pressure to make "higher education" -- or rather, academic credentials -- accessible (albeit within a capitalist framework that involves debilitating debt). There is the economic pressure an individual institution -- top-heavy with worthless administrators -- faces. There's pressure from anxious and desperate "students" who want to improve their prospects in a dead-end and declining economy, where blue-collar jobs not requiring schooling have largely disappeared (that the credentials they pursue won't improve their lot is another matter). <br /><br />If a CC had the curriculum of seventy years ago, it would promptly lost the majority of its customers (er, students). I don't really see a panacea to the spiral of declining standards. School education would need to be improved, the lies of politicians and CC bureaucrats curtailed, and job opportunities for those with no academic bent (probably 80% of the population) established. I see no prospect for this on the horizon.AAhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13242448989166177843noreply@blogger.com